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| Sunday October 22, 2017
 
It's Official: F-22 production stopped at 187 aircraft
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Defense Secretary Robert Gates said Monday the Pentagon will end the F-22 fighter jet and White House helicopter programs run by Lockheed, but would increase production of the company's Joint Strike Fighter.
06-04-2009 - Washington DC -- Job and other budget figures released by Gates sought to assuage fears of deep cuts at the nation's largest defense contractor and its suppliers, helping Lockheed shares to rise nearly 9 percent.

Gates recommended more than doubling the number of Joint Strike Fighters to 30 in the upcoming budget, which would increase funding to $11.2 billion from $6.8 billion.


Watch Nr Gates making the announcement


According to the Pentagon, there already are 38,000 employees working on the next-generation stealth fighter jet, known as the F-35. That number is anticipated to jump to 82,000 in fiscal 2011.

Still, Bethesda, Md.-based Lockheed has said almost 95,000 jobs — mostly in California, Texas, Georgia and Connecticut — could be at risk if the Pentagon didn't buy more F-22 jets.

Gates offered a very different employment picture, saying the number of direct jobs would fall to 13,000 in fiscal 2011 from 24,000 this year.

JSA Research Inc. analyst Paul Nisbet said the disparity of F-22 and Joint Strike Fighter job figures appeared to "surprise a few people" and was enough to offset Lockheed losing two major programs.

Military analysts widely expected the radar-evading supersonic F-22 jet — considered an outdated weapon system — would not go beyond the 187 already planned. The planes cost $140 million each.

Lockheed said it's assessing the impact of Gates' decision on several defense programs.

Most of the F-22's are being built in Marietta, Ga. and Fort Worth, Texas. Boeing Co. manufactures the wings and other parts in Seattle. The engines are supplied by Pratt & Whitney, a United Technologies Corp. unit, in Middletown, Conn.

Georgia Republican Reps. Phil Gingrey and Johnny Isakson said Gates' decision put thousands of manufacturing jobs at risk. And Jeff Goen, president of the union representing Lockheed's employees in metro Atlanta, said layoffs are inevitable unless Congress restores the fighter program.

"It's going devastate many families here," Goen said.

Goen didn't know how many jobs might be lost, but said Lockheed has about 2,000 workers — out of 7,000 at its Georgia plant — assigned to the F-22. The union, the International Association of Machinists Local 709, represents about 1,200 employees working on the jet's assembly.

Matthew Perra, a spokesman for Pratt & Whitney, said that without additional F-22 aircraft orders, the company will be forced to halt orders from suppliers within months.

Hartford, Conn.-based United Technologies last month announced plans to trim 11,600 jobs from its global work force. And the company's CEO Louis Chenevert has said the diversified manufacturer may cut an additional 2,000 to 3,000 jobs in Connecticut if the Pentagon cancels production of the F-22.

Plans to buy a new fleet of White House helicopters also were among the programs terminated by Gates. With a price tag of $13 billion and a six-year delay, the helicopters were considered at risk to be cut in the 2010 budget.

Obama has said he would closely examine the program, noting that his current ride seemed "perfectly adequate."

Gates said the Pentagon will look into other options in fiscal 2011 for a new program to replace the aging helicopter fleet.

Cost overruns and delays have plagued Lockheed's program due partly to aggressive plans by the Bush administration to incorporate anti-missile defenses, communications equipment, hardened hulls and other advanced capabilities on the helicopters following the 9/11 terrorist attacks.

The Navy waited nearly a year before formally disclosing the information to lawmakers as it sought to find ways to keep the program within budget. Those efforts failed.

Source: AP

COMMENTS:

its the biggest mistake to cancel these fighter, it is already in production and its already proven the best fighter in the world.

nonito antonio cabato | posted on Apr 07, 2009 @ 01:05


186 f -22 is more than sufficient. A threat does not or will not exist in the near future that would require half this many aircraft for more than a few weeks. Not to mention a larger number of f 35s will be ample to bolster the force. Surely the next generation is underway, will probably be without a pilot in the cockpit, and will allow for performances inconceivable with a manned aircraft of today. As far as the lost jobs, that should have NO consequence to the appropriate force strength.

Peter Furfari | posted on Apr 07, 2009 @ 02:00


STUPID!! This is what happens we liberals are in control!
The F35 is a flying stump, a 2nd rate fighter compared to Russian and Chineese newcomers. Weak minded fools! Decisions like this will end in our blood.

Regan | posted on Apr 07, 2009 @ 03:11


another example of how obama plans to destroy this
country's ability to defend itself. way to go barry!

john Cushing | posted on Apr 07, 2009 @ 04:20


I've seen the x-35 up close. It's no F-22.

nunya | posted on Apr 07, 2009 @ 05:38


Russia and China are laughing their heads off.

The Obama government is making sure that this country goes down.

Idiots. Unfortunately they are now so strong that we will never get the Liberal Democrats out of power. Especially after they grant citizenship to the 12 to 15 million illegals in the country.

Example: 65,000 illegal's graduated from US High Schools last year and you the US Taxpayer paid for their education. They now qualify for scholarships which should be going to the children of legal American citizens. Just the tip of the pyramid. And you wonder why your taxes are going higher and higher.

Wake up!



Paul | posted on Apr 07, 2009 @ 13:13


Even though Gates has made his announcment, the final word rest with congress and I hear that half of congress is in favor of builsding more raptors. So we will have to wait and see what congress does.

cs | posted on Apr 07, 2009 @ 16:21


Even though Gates has made his announcment, the final word rest with congress and I hear that half of congress is in favor of builsding more raptors. So we will have to wait and see what congress does.

cs | posted on Apr 07, 2009 @ 16:21


I sure hope congress wakes up and continues to fun the 22 program. The 35 is nothing more than a lawn dart as the 16 always has been. The 22 can go in and destroy all the sam and radar systems before they even know we're coming. Then you can send in the lawn darts to clean up.

Ed | posted on Apr 07, 2009 @ 17:13


Same old arguments for wasteful pork spending. Russia and China. Guess what , they have no plans to kill their golden goose the USA. They need us. We need them.Fear should not cause us to waste our money. How effective were the B-1, B-2 B-58. What a waste.
It is not a liberal decision, it is true concern for an effective defense force.



Ridgca | posted on Apr 07, 2009 @ 18:35


Liberals! There goes our militairy!

Jon | posted on Apr 07, 2009 @ 19:50


Don't think unmanned vehicles can replace F22 against sophisticated airborne threats from future enemies. Unmanned or F35 better suited for taking out SAM sites or delivering air to ground strikes. Both unmanned and F35 need protection provided by F22 to complete their mission. We probably need at least 500 F22's if not more.

Dean | posted on Apr 07, 2009 @ 20:06


Honestly there is too much waste going on in these companies. Hourly workers work extra slow to engage in overtime. They come and go as they please and waste a ton of money on overtime each week. Maybe if they kept the work week to 40 hours then they could save money there. The gov can't continue to pay for this wasteful spending especially going on at Sikorksy. Cutting some hourly workers may not be a bad idea, it would even things out a bit.

Shell | posted on Apr 08, 2009 @ 18:59


As a person from aerospace I have to say that this is the dumbest thing that may have been done. F-22 is way to far in production, with fly-away cost below 140 million USD. F-35 is yet unproven, but for certain kinematically inferior airplane to F-22 (speed, acceleration, wing/loading, thrust to weight ration, operatinal altitude and so on and so on...), designed with strike, not fighter role in mind. Inferior in flight parameters to 25 years old Su-27, clearly outcl.ed by newer Su-35 that is being tested now, and no match for latest PAK-FA fighter now under construction in Novosibirsk Aviation plant, to fly for the first time this year. This is the day US gave up on its air power, and its role in the world. Way to go, Mr. Gates and Mr. Obama, I have to brush up my Russian and start my Chinese, as you are a symptoms of Roman Empire just before its fall. I feel sorry for America, country that gave me so much that I have always admired and always will, and for USAF that Mr. Gates gutted with no mercy for his yesterday-war-ities, and gave a finger to Japan and Israel who had been repeatedly asking for F-22s.
Also many thanks for your no (in the sense none) opinion on your radar base in Czech Republic, you have really had us for some time, we have thought you were serious with us this time. Russia won this round 2:0.
Martin, Prague, Czech Republic

Martin | posted on Apr 08, 2009 @ 22:53


Before Shell talks about workers wroking extra slow he/she should see the painstaking quality that has to go into making these aitrcraft. I work for a supplier for the F-22 andwill have work no matter which way the government goes. But before anyone makes comments such as shell did about the waste they should learn the quality and precision that has to go into making these aircraft. There is no doubt Russia and China do want to bring us to our

rid | posted on Apr 09, 2009 @ 15:48


Just like the time when the F-4 was supposed to be the do-all, heck doesnt even need guns. That was until the Mig17 & 19 started winning. The F22 shoudl be kept into low prodcution at least for 10 years. Yes Isreal, the UK, Japan, and Austrailia should get them.

This is STUPID. The SU35 will dominate the F-35.

Zoob | posted on Apr 09, 2009 @ 17:50


i also work on the f-22 as a mechanic i honestly believe that ending the program is a huge mistake first off they dont cost 140 million. on the raptors worst day it can shoot down anything in its vary best day. it has been said who ever owns the skies wins the battle. this aircraft is capable of more things than anyone knows. espically the people who get there information from the internet you are only getting the information you need to know.
FYI--- there has never been a f-15 shot down in battle ever. if you ever get to talk to a f-15 pilot who has gone up against a f-22 ask them how it was. and ask them to be honest. i have talked to a couple and they said it sucked they didnt stand a chance and the raptor pilot said " it was like shooting fish in a barrell" if you want to look at cost run this number what is it going to cost to maintain the old f-15 fleet remember when we lost our first eagle due to its age and we grounded the entire fleet the cost to repair each eagle was aroung 400 thousand each just for parts not including man hours fixing them not to mention some of those parts arent available anymore so look at the whole picture of things before deciding to end a program that will keep us safe for the next 50 plus years

jason | posted on Apr 11, 2009 @ 18:08


Everyone, get accustomed to eating chinese food and drinking russian vodka for breakfast, lunch, and dinner. Thanks for nothing gates.

chris l. | posted on Apr 11, 2009 @ 19:20


Like i said eariler, THE FINAL DECISION REST WITH CONGRESS. SO LETS HOLD OUR HORSES UNTIL CONGRESS DECIDES WHAT TO DO.

cs | posted on Apr 11, 2009 @ 22:34


George W Bush would never have allowed the saftey of this nation to be weakened by stupid liberal decisions like this. Now barak Obama is finaly starting to show his true agenda of Islamic terrorism. Its always been clear to anyone with a brain that all Obama ever wanted was to destroy this great nation. America will suffer horribly because of turning its back on the policies of the greatest statesman and religious leader western civilization has ever produced: President George W. Bush.

fred | posted on Apr 11, 2009 @ 23:29


The F22? Carter did a lot to degrade the military. That is why Reagan won so easily. Clinton got his budget surplus by financially raping the military budget. Obumma, following in their socialistic pattern, is chopping the military also. Obumma wants to "invest" in education and Canadian style health care. Both are socialistic financial rat holes. Cutting the military will leave us vulnerable to attack by the Red Chinese and Russians. Look for the Reds to take Taiwan at the cost of a lot of American military lives because the necessary military hardware will not be available win the defense of the island. Hey, Obumma, are you just a socialist or are you really a Communist?

Edward Hesson | posted on Apr 12, 2009 @ 09:09


The F-22 is the premier fighter flying today and in teh foreseeable future. The F-35 will be a good ground pounder, but not a good dogfighter. I only hope they build enough F-35's to supply combat replacements. The F-22 will not require combat replacements. The loss of test aircraft is a terrible waste of a good airframe, but given the job of the TEST PROGRAM, these losses are to be expected (although rare). Looks like the economy of scale wasn't to help the F-22 due to export restrictions. I only hope the F-35 proves as good as the detractors claim. The F-15/F-16 won't be around to bail them out and the F-22 will be too few to be in more than one theater of combat. The F-35 has HUGE requirements to fill for all three services.

Anthony Conner | posted on Apr 13, 2009 @ 21:10


hmmmmm lets see where to start oh yea isnt this guy robert gates the former head of homeland security for the bush administration? is he civilian or military? why is it that wen i see a secretary of defense hes not wearing 3 stars and a buncha medals in a green suit? i dont think he even grasps the concept of what it takes to power the most powerful military on the face of the planet. that its all about those wonderful toys. i also heard that they scraped the als air bourne laser system a giant chrome plated turd i hear on the comedy show. none of this was a shock just a tear in someones eye. seems that they abandon those precious technological advancements in stoppin nukes from being launched and dominating the skies which would include ours. im all about health care for vets but thats rediculous cutting essentials future weapon systems to take care of ppl who should have their own "earmarks" shame on obama glad i didnt vote for him

E.Zod | posted on Apr 14, 2009 @ 22:39


I guess when Obama talks about Americans building things again, he didn't mean high skilled labor. I thought he made a remark about engineers and skilled labor being the backbone of our economy. Apparently it doesn't apply to those of you who work on projects like the F22 and protecting our country. How can he and Gates justify this?
A liberal decision based on the fact that he has to find money somewhere so he can claim he is cutting the deficit, while bailing out those that caused this mess. This is not the time to cut contracts with companies that are already bleeding. It is just more of the same. Shame on them.
Lets not wait for Congress to make a decision, everyone should email their congress reps and give them our opinions. Lets make them represent us, the majority. I sent one to my Senator, John McCain, for whom I voted.

Sharon | posted on Apr 15, 2009 @ 00:31


The final decision rests with the PEOPLE. Congress represents us. The wait-and-see approach is mediocre, because not much good comes out of D.C. lately. (district of communism?) Everyone must speak up about the F-22 situation because it can be changed. Congress will listen when the people knock on their doors. Tell Congress and/ or the administration that you would rather have Air Superiority fighters than "green jobs", an electric car, or a failed universal healthcare sytem like canada's.

chris l. | posted on Apr 15, 2009 @ 22:04


shut up paul you racist basterd!

Brandon | posted on Apr 16, 2009 @ 04:58


either we're invaded by another contry or were able to hold them off with the F-15s and end up broke. then are cildren have to pay for Obamas stupidties. and most of the world hates us I might add.

Brandon | posted on Apr 16, 2009 @ 06:06


its the most stupidest thing a pentagon official to cancel this F-22, it is already in production! you dont cancel a program which is already in high production! its a waste of money and the wasted research and development to consider! your Sec. Gates is a moron. Its been proven in simulated in combat like th northern edge exercise and in red flag! if you buy in large number the cost will go down

russia and china is building fifth generation fighterand dont underestimate them they build better fighter too! thats how get kick in world war two because your leader is naive. as for me buy the reaAL NUMBER IS 648 PLANE!

nonito antonio cabato | posted on Apr 16, 2009 @ 10:08


F-22 is NOT outdated,Pilotless aircraft is pie in the sky nonsense touted by Mental Midgits, NO WAY can a Pilot less piece of jumk do what a manned fighter can...What a COLOSSAL ERROR those MORONS in Washington have done..The Russians, Indians and Chinese must be partying gleefully ...America seems on a trend to self inflicted suicide...
R/I/P/ U.S.A...

Stormhelm | posted on Apr 17, 2009 @ 14:14


>>>186 f -22 is more than sufficient. A threat does not or will not exist in the near future that would require half this many aircraft for more than a few weeks. Not to mention a larger number of f 35s will be ample to bolster the force. Surely the next generation is underway, will probably be without a pilot in the cockpit, and will allow for performances inconceivable with a manned aircraft of today. As far as the lost jobs, that should have NO consequence to the appropriate force strength.

PLEIKU | posted on Apr 17, 2009 @ 14:16


F-15 and 16 wearing out.F-35 no way better tyhen Sukhois and why are American governmet so stupid? I cannot believe she would throwaway an .et that will dominate anything thrown at it. I am sorry for you Americans and you are accelerating your global decline with rash decisions by rich people who do not care if others loose jobs or defense of nation.
Anwar.

Anwar | posted on Apr 17, 2009 @ 14:20


Obama and company sucks! Let his Tribe defend us.
Poor pilots when dogfighting SUPERIOR Russian fighters.

clod of hod | posted on Apr 17, 2009 @ 14:22


Hey Obama stump boy YOU ARE FULL OF IT!!! sure keep dreamomh white upper middle cl. flunky.

Same old arguments for wasteful pork spending. Russia and China. Guess what , they have no plans to kill their golden goose the USA. They need us. We need them.Fear should not cause us to waste our money. How effective were the B-1, B-2 B-58. What a waste.
It is not a liberal decision, it is true concern for an effective defense force.

fran | posted on Apr 17, 2009 @ 14:24


Take note Messrs, Chavez, Uribe and other would be Central-South American Dicks, Your Leftist Friends in Washington have handed you a victory.
However; I would LOVE to see you rabble send your Sukhois and MiGs against Raptors
Case closed...

Pete | posted on Apr 17, 2009 @ 14:38


What did you expect.....

When you put socialists in power who want to destroy our
country and our economy. They always start by butchering
our defense capabilities, and putting us at risk. These communists will love nothing more than to destroy our fine
military. Gates is a Jack-Ass. These communists will one day
see a true judgement - for they will be responsible for the death millions of American souls.

Look at the bright side however. When our enemies see a weakness in out defense net and attack. They will nuke the cities first. Which is where a majority of thier constiuency
comes from.

The bad news is that the cost in lives of the folks left to regain our country will be horrific. History is about to repeat itself in America. We will probably go they way of the Roman Empire.
The Mongols are coming. Remember Pearl Harbor.


Frank | posted on Apr 22, 2009 @ 04:36


This is a very poor decision which could impact US National Security in the years to come. Basically, there are several points / facts which need to be exposed rather than hidden or embellished. We don't need, nor can we afford 500-600 of these terrribly expensive, yet unmatched aircraft; however, 187 is just not a credible force number given attrition / accident rate over the long term. I'd suggest perhaps another 100 or so aircraft would be a credible force, near 300 or so, for say 12 operational squadrons and extra aircraft for testing and expected attrition over time.

Points)

1. The F-35 is NOT a true 5th generation aircraft as it its touted by LM and the Pentagon. It's a 4th generation with additional capabilities - and yes it is superior to the Sukhoi series and other worldwide 4th generation aircraft in existence today. The problem is that both China and Russia are developing their own versions of the F-22, which is the ONLY true 5th generation fighter in existence.

2. Given a future China conflict over say Taiwan, do we as a nation want to be in a position of fighting say a greater number of Chinese F-22 variants than we possess due to insufficent production, in an initial air superiority realm? I can imagine other future scenarios in which the US might seriously regret such a small F-22 procurement.

3. The F-35 is a very capable aircraft, well suited to replace the F-16, older F-18s, Harrier, and to some extent the A-10 (although no multi-role aircraft with a lesser gun, 25 vs 30 mm, will do the CAS mission as well as the A-10). However, we need a larger production of the one TRUE 5th generation fighter with thrust vectoring, more stealth capabilities than the F-35 possesses, and supercruise as a replacement for the F-15. The F-22 also possesses substantial air/ground capabilities - it's essentially a replacement for the F-15E if you will. 187 is just not a credible force level.

4. Secretary Gates and the Pentagon DO NOT make this decision on purchase levels - they make recommendations. Make no mistake, Congress and the House/Senate Armed Service Committees are the boss in aggregate. I hope they weigh in, not just due to jobs which the Pentagon is not primarily responsible to fund of course, but due to future US National Security interest.

Wade Turner | posted on Apr 22, 2009 @ 14:55


I'm from a forth generation military family and have been a crewcheif on A-10's and F-16's. My view on this whole ordeal is to wait and see what congress says about the 'Raptor'program and go from there. We are not going to be defensless and bow down to the russians, chinese, or anybody else for that matter! Finally, if half of you cowards actually join the military instead of being the barstool soldiers that you are, maybe you would have a little more faith in the military, the aircraft, and the men and women that where the uniform. We bow down to no one! so you cowards go practice your chinese and russian while the rest of us real soldiers wait and see how this turns out. Bye the way, if you have never served any time in the armed forces, your opinion means nothing to no one but YOU!

DON C. | posted on Apr 22, 2009 @ 21:32


its the biggest mistake to cancel the production of the f-22 you dont cancel the F-22 since it is already in full rate production! your sec. of defense is a moron for doing that! its multi role fighter it can do air to air and air to ground mission, it is fast, agile and stealthy! its an all american plane because all its parts and accessories are made in the united states of america! not like the F-35 most of its parts are made in other countries, what if one of the country throw a monkey wrench, all the production will become diss array! its proven in many real like combat exercise like the northen edge exercise

its biggest mistake to cancel its production, built up to1,000 of it, let other nation to worry especially your enemies you prepare for war that your will encounter in the future!

you are wasting you money in a war that not concern your security! if you use the money to buy raptor you can buy three times over

it is stupid to fight a war for other country, let them fight there own battle, if they CANT fight then they no right to be a nation, let them bleed for there own battle!

nonito antonio cabato | posted on Apr 25, 2009 @ 03:17


I dont understand the logic of your defense secretary to cancel the F-22, his reason it is a cold relic. his other reasons is that no fighter will match it in performance! why he is a bondoggle that why you built better fighter so your enemy will not challenge you!

Tell your defense secretary that war is not a game its life and death situation. there no such thing a fair fight in war, if thats his thinking his tactic SUCKS. JUST what the F-15 pilots when they fight the raptor in the exercise they die by the wholesale. as what patton said let the other poor damm bastard die by their country NOT YOU PILOTS!

thats what happen in world war 2 when your pilots tangle with the ZEROS. do he want to repeat that again

nonito antonio cabato | posted on Apr 26, 2009 @ 10:10


By the way, the average age of F-15s and F-16s ???? F-117s (recently retired, anybody know that ????)

chris l. | posted on Apr 29, 2009 @ 18:39


Chris, the F-15 prototype first flew in 1972 then became operational in 1974. The F-16 prototype first flew in 1976 then became operational in 1978. The F-117 first flew in 1978 in a almost completely different form called "Have Blue", then became operational in 1981 I beleive under the code name, "Senior Trend" & was officially cl.ified, "Top Secret." And now the Night Hawk is retired... Do the math, our Great US AirForce fleet are definitely getting old. As far as the F-22A Raptor is concerned, we need more of these awesome aircrafts & one more note: Mr Robert Gates is a "FOOL!!!"

T Flex | posted on Apr 30, 2009 @ 15:57


With any budget, you only have a finite amount of resources to met an unlimited demand. If the United States got into a war with India, China or Russia, the war would most likely escalate into a nuclear conflict. No one will survive that kind of war. Right now the USAF is commited to supporting ground forces because that's the type of war we are fighting. You can argue here and demand that a war with Russia is immenent while our soldiers are dying in Afghanistan and Iraq. Those boys don't need hundred million dollar stealth fighters. They need large numbers of F-16s and F-15s carrying several LGBs apiece and a lot of CAS and air support that can loiter on station.

Tony | posted on May 07, 2009 @ 20:00


Obama and Gates are IDIOTS! The F-15 and F-16s are aging out, we need new planes to replace them. It was obvious the replacements for the aging fleet were going to be expensive. Just look at all the inflation and they were planning for this 20 years ago! Hello! OBVIOUS it was going to be expensive! What do you expect? Do you honest to god think the best technology is going to be cheap? If it was, EVERYONE would have it and we would not be able to maintain air superiority. We ARE going to go to war with the Chinese. We don't know when, but we will. We have to keep up with the military technologies so that we can hold off on going to war. If we didn't have the best, we would be at war with so many countries. If we didn't spend so much money on defense, we'd all probably be speaking either German or Russian by now.

KJ | posted on May 20, 2009 @ 16:47


Try using logic & reason all you idealogs who are saying "liberals, Obama, blah blah this & that". I realize your all in love with the Raptors, and its hard not to be, but as an independent , THINK FOR YOURSELF, quit parroting the paranoid partisan crap that has nothing to do with making a logical, reasoned, pragmatic, sensible decision not just based on how afraid you are of threats that don't exist beyond the capabilities of the PLENTY of Raptors and other advanced weapons systems we already have. The Country has REAL NEEDS happening NOW, and you want to go blow more ridiculous amounts of $$$ on policing the world. If you actually care about this Country, how about accepting that we have far superior weapons quality and capabilities, spend way way more per year than anyone else on defense, that our President and Republican Bob Gates care about the Country and love their families just as much as anyone else, no matter what the TV or radio hosts you let think for you say, and all your twisted logic of how we have to keep defense jobs so we have to buy the most expensive aircraft and stay at war so we don't have to go to war is why defense contractors think they can (and do every time) absolutely charge whatever they want and then still double, triple, and on and on the price, to the point where we have had to cancel weapons programs and WASTE literally BILLIONS of $$$, never even having anything to show for it. Don't let your love of Raptors and paranoia get in the way of what is actually the most intelligent BALANCE between protection and prosperity. We have bigger threats from people like many here forgetting completely a little phrase- "E Pluribus Unum". Remember- UNITED WE STAND, DIVIDED WE FALL? That is how the Chinese and the Russians, etc. are trying to defeat us. By helping the politicians, Big Biz, competition for jobs, TV pundits, etc. all those people making their living by tearing this country apart. They don't even need 1 plane, they'll just let us continue to tear each other apart, encourage it a little, and then surp. us financially taking away our ability to manufacture on the same scale. Divide and conquer.

Think | posted on May 22, 2009 @ 11:32


Try using logic & reason all you idealogs who are saying "liberals, Obama, blah blah this & that". I realize your all in love with the Raptors, and its hard not to be, but as an independent , THINK FOR YOURSELF, quit parroting the paranoid partisan crap that has nothing to do with making a logical, reasoned, pragmatic, sensible decision not just based on how afraid you are of threats that don't exist beyond the capabilities of the PLENTY of Raptors and other advanced weapons systems we already have. The Country has REAL NEEDS happening NOW, and you want to go blow more ridiculous amounts of $$$ on policing the world. If you actually care about this Country, how about accepting that we have far superior weapons quality and capabilities, spend way way more per year than anyone else on defense, that our President and Republican Bob Gates care about the Country and love their families just as much as anyone else, no matter what the TV or radio hosts you let think for you say, and all your twisted logic of how we have to keep defense jobs so we have to buy the most expensive aircraft and stay at war so we don't have to go to war is why defense contractors think they can (and do every time) absolutely charge whatever they want and then still double, triple, and on and on the price, to the point where we have had to cancel weapons programs and WASTE literally BILLIONS of $$$, never even having anything to show for it. Don't let your love of Raptors and paranoia get in the way of what is actually the most intelligent BALANCE between protection and prosperity. We have bigger threats from people like many here forgetting completely a little phrase- "E Pluribus Unum". Remember- UNITED WE STAND, DIVIDED WE FALL? That is how the Chinese and the Russians, etc. are trying to defeat us. By helping the politicians, Big Biz, competition for jobs, TV pundits, etc. all those people making their living by tearing this country apart. They don't even need 1 plane, they'll just let us continue to tear each other apart, encourage it a little, and then surp. us financially taking away our ability to manufacture on the same scale. Divide and conquer.

Think | posted on May 22, 2009 @ 11:32


And just for the record, there are some good reasoned positions on why to increase beyond the recommendations F-22s/or similar capability aircraft, but:
a) We can't allow the defense contractors to continue charging whatever they want and holding us hostage by drumming up fear in the media on certain news networks or by squeezing in the media and lobbying weak character politicians using job loss threats.
b) the purpose of having these superior aircraft is that they are capable of tracking and defeating several threats simultaneously, so looking at force levels on a 1:1 basis is the wrong way to go about it. Otherwise what is the price-tag really getting us when it costs the price of several of our other excellent fighters that we are actually using and the military needs right now like UAVs.
c) perhaps the best thing to do would be just to drop production dramatically to keep them trickling in without the obscene cost of so many when the country can't afford it, but where it allows us to ratchet up the number in our arsenal when the Chinese & Russians finally finish the development process for their supposed 5th gens. Thus we would maintain our dramatic advantage and capabilities to continue it.
d) Until people stop focusing of Liberal/Conservative and start on hammering the businesses, mindset, and culture that are sending our money, manufacturing, and jobs (i.e. the middle cl.) to countries that would love to destroy us and start to wake up to uniting to strengthen and fix our Country and maintain our economic superiority, than it doesn't matter how incredibly advanced our weapons are as we will have already lost our Country to them. they will have the jobs, the peace that comes with prosperity, and the skills and technology to build the next generation of superior weaponry.

Think | posted on May 22, 2009 @ 11:59


I have seen so many of you say that the raptor is so advanced compared to the F35 Joint strike fighter. have any of you even looked at the F-35 which far out performs and out cl.es the raptor. Within the f-35's three versions you have a plane capable of vertical take off and landings like the harrier jet only with more control and precision. A jet that can out maneuver the new superhornet in a dog-fight, and a stealth craft with technology that makes the F-22 look like the Hindenburg in comparison. So this Lawn-Dart is actually one of the most advanced and versatile war planes ever created. This is how we will ensure that we stay ahead in a war is by dropping that which is out dated and replacing it with something better.

Jason | posted on May 30, 2009 @ 07:39


Think :

You are wrong. You say we have enough raptors and right now we do. The problem is in about five years eagles will be forcibly retired due to airframe hours The F-35 will not still be available in large numbers in five years, nor was it designed to be an air superiority fighter.

Jason:

You are also wrong. The F-22 out performs the F-35 on every level. It can cruise at less than 100% throttle faster than the F-35 can go on full burner. The F-22 has a higher thrust to weight ratio, higher service ceiling, longer range, and larger payload capacity. The raptor could turn circles around the F-35 in a dogfight as the F-35 does not have thrust vectoring. The ability of a jet to take off vertically requires it to sacrifice speed, fuel capacity, and manuevorability in order to accomadate the life fan equipment. You people don't know what you are talking about so please shut up.

DON C.:

Don't tell me I don't have an opinion because I am not in the military. I do have complete confidence in our forces. The problem is that in a few years several countries our going to have superior aircraft and that is very dangerous. Currently in a dogfight (which has been simulated with Indian Air Force Sukhois) within 10 miles the F-15's and F-16's lose 90% of the engagements. In BVR (Beyond Visual Range) the F-15 and F-16 wins, however the new Sukhois are rectifying that situation. So shut your popous mouth and wake up and smell the coffee.

Mark | posted on Jun 01, 2009 @ 19:48


For all those of you who don't believe me look up the specs on af.mil or wikipedia or Lockheeds page. Go on try it. See for your self that the F-35 is not intended to replace the raptor but to supliment it. The last time an idiot tried to get all the arms of the military to use the same plane was Robert McNamara and he came up with the worthless F-111. It was a crappy fighter, and it was to big to take off from a carrier. The Navy had to go on to develop the F-14 and the Air Force had to Develop the F-15. If it were possible to build an aircraft that could do everything good, don't you think we would have done it already? You opponents of the Raptor show your ignorant mentality and really seem clue less when it comes to aerospace technology. I am an engineer and know what I am talking about so do try to discredit me on educational grounds. I have studied aircraft my whole life and read book after book on aerial warfare. You opponents are wrong period. The Raptor is the best plane ever produced. Cutting it is as smart as cutting off your thumb.

Mark | posted on Jun 01, 2009 @ 19:56


Marks right. The F-22s are superior but the STOVAL F-35 would be and are best for quick recovery, like if a runway gets taken out or if theres a surface attack. The F-22 that are up can take care of air superiority while the F-35s clean up the mess on the ground.

Brandon | posted on Jun 04, 2009 @ 03:47


Well as i see it, first off, Russia is not going to produce the su-35, or 47, into production, they are remodding the su-27, so the f-35 could handle its own, infact the reason why the f-35 did not get the trust vectoring unit installed is called 20 mil a plane, stupid,yes but with it pointless because of the aircraft, now russia has in the works the t-50 stealth craft, which looks worse than the f-35 as a missle platform, ANYWAYS yes it sucks that the raptor is cut short i would like to see 250 made, BUT everyone on here has to realize, the electronics, in both the f-35 and f-22 are top notch, infact even more so in the f-35, which is a attack plane, but can hold its own in combat, dont bash the f-16, or 15 they are incedible nice aircraft, the f-22 is incredible dominate, BUT is not needed, i mean with new technologies in l.er development, and our three stage missle defense system, i mean look we will be ok, i know many on here are mad about the f-14 going into retirement, BUT again its not needed, hell 187 raptors, is more than enough one can have a 6 to 1 kill ratio, multiply that by 187, not to mention other planes we have, f-35, superhornet, and whatever else isnt scraped. i hate the cutback too but im realistic when it comes to that the government is a bunch of good ole boys doing what they can to get a piece of the pie, you want it to change GO RUN FOR OFFICE!!! OR TAKE IT EITHER WAY STOP BITCHING AND DO WHAT YOU YOU YOU CAN to get things right!!!!!!!!

josh | posted on Jun 09, 2009 @ 16:19


josh:

You are wrong we do need the raptor. The F-35 is a spectacular airplane, but once again you are failing to realize a simple truth, it was designed for air to ground operations and is not suited to serve as an air superiority fighter. The F-15 and F-16 are great. But a Su-27 with updated electronics and a competent pilot would be a serious threat to either one. In a dogfight with equally skilled pilots the F-15/16 loses almost every time to Su-27. Also tell me what you don't understand about this. The F-15's in service are aging. They will soon reach the safety limits on their airframes. This means they are no longer air worthy. If we only produce 187 raptors that will not be enough to fill the void of the hundreds of airplane forcibly retired from service. Now you have to options. Restart the f-16 and f-15 productions lines at huge cost, or use the already function raptor production line. You tell me which makes more sense: spending millions to build a 1970's airplane or spending millions to produce an up to date fighter? When a war starts and we need more raptors it will be to late. It will take years to restart the lines and get the planes rolling out, what price will we pay for not being prepared?

Mark | posted on Jun 09, 2009 @ 20:06


Wait I thaught the raptor program was finished. We can start it over again?

Brandon | posted on Jun 25, 2009 @ 01:42


F22 is a piece of crap that costs 140mil$ each. Thank God that it will be just 186 planes. Bring back the Tomcat, F15 and F16 to action again!!!! Adapt the technology to those planes and theyll becom eunbeateble.

Luke | posted on Jun 26, 2009 @ 05:34


the only reason anybody is killing this move by gates is simply the fact that obama and democrats are in office and even if something looks like it will work and even prove to be successful the conservative/republican party people will go against it. it's all partisan. such a bitter mindset. does anybody realize not one f-22 raptor flew one single mission in the iraq or afganistan affairs.- look it up. you guys are clinically insane. your temper is dillusional. you failed with regulation nationally and with the lenders and banks. your party created this recession. plain and simple. keep watching fox news and continue to keep a borderline racist mindset. we love watching these people bury themselves in a hole. it really makes my day!

Z.D.H. | posted on Jun 27, 2009 @ 18:42


need i repeat not one mission. 140 million each. not one mission. not one mission- getting it yet? but i can join all of you and say "obama is trying to destroy our country and families and homes and military. he is the worst president we have ever had. china and russia will destroy us"- you see...? read that. honestly how ignorant does that sound. re-read what you guys write. seriously. you cant say that some of the comments about this move are beyond ignorance and partisanship. look in the mirror. look at the bush administration, 105th-109th congress, the republican majority. look hard. honestly, study the legislation hard. its as obvious and the sun is in the sky. but im sure me being a democrat and studying legislative and economic history for 6 years means nothing. and my research about the f-22's being built without flying a single mission means nothing either. im just a stupid liberal right? i feel for you guys. i really do. that's all i need to write. these negative comments and mindset about obama is destroying your own party and not helping your chance for any presidental or congress elections in the future. most everyone can see right through your parties far-right people now. the attacks with nothing to back them up are getting extremely old. give me one credible thing the republican party has done for the nation in the last ten years. im not saying they didn't but just find me one thing. start giving credit to your own party. make your own new ideas. come up with something! your stradegy failed in 2008 election and will continue to fail unless you get up and make decisions instead of attack attack attack. but if you must please continue. i love being entertained. the end.

Z.D.H. | posted on Jun 27, 2009 @ 18:53


need i repeat not one mission. 140 million each. not one mission. not one mission- getting it yet? but i can join all of you and say "obama is trying to destroy our country and families and homes and military. he is the worst president we have ever had. china and russia will destroy us"- you see...? read that. honestly how ignorant does that sound. re-read what you guys write. seriously. you cant say that some of the comments about this move are beyond ignorance and partisanship. look in the mirror. look at the bush administration, 105th-109th congress, the republican majority. look hard. honestly, study the legislation hard. its as obvious and the sun is in the sky. but im sure me being a democrat and studying legislative and economic history for 6 years means nothing. and my research about the f-22's being built without flying a single mission means nothing either. im just a stupid liberal right? i feel for you guys. i really do. that's all i need to write. these negative comments and mindset about obama is destroying your own party and not helping your chance for any presidental or congress elections in the future. most everyone can see right through your parties far-right people now. the attacks with nothing to back them up are getting extremely old. give me one credible thing the republican party has done for the nation in the last ten years. im not saying they didn't but just find me one thing. start giving credit to your own party. make your own new ideas. come up with something! your stradegy failed in 2008 election and will continue to fail unless you get up and make decisions instead of attack attack attack. but if you must please continue. i love being entertained. the end.

Z.D.H. | posted on Jun 27, 2009 @ 18:54


f-22 equals 2 many dollars spent on a defense project. every hour flown requires 30 hours of maintenance? I heard on the xm radio? please, it wont be able to stay effective in a combat zone, you cant stop and maintain a aircraft that requires that many hours per hours flown, while engaging low tech, and hearty aircraft are flying above your airfields. Lets move on to aircraft that are worth their pay, f-16,f-18,etc. up grade their systems, and lets get this economy on its feet, before we spend ourselves into a stalemate. Do you think the Chinks are going to attack us with bullets, they already own us, even the secretary of state has just conferred with them about our plans to pay them back (they are buying our debt).

carlos garcia | posted on Jul 16, 2009 @ 02:49


Groimg up in the 50's and the 60's in the Air Force the F-22 is awhsome and we need more technology. 186 is not enough!

frank young | posted on Jul 20, 2009 @ 05:47


Hey mr "studying legislative and economic history for 6 years" it's Strategy, not "stradegy". Bottom line, your son is an Air Force fighter pilot, headed into a hot zone...which fighter do you want him flying......

Joe | posted on Jul 21, 2009 @ 22:06


Hey mr "studying legislative and economic history for 6 years" it's Strategy, not "stradegy". Bottom line, your son is an Air Force fighter pilot, headed into a hot zone...which fighter do you want him flying......

Joe | posted on Jul 21, 2009 @ 22:06


Let's face it: A/A has been dead a LONG time (since Vietnam), and the Fighter Mafia's day is done. Period. And that's all the F-22 ever was: a security blanket for fighter jocks who thought that they were too good for CAS.

I knew the -22 was doomed as soon as it became the "F/A-22"; nothing more than a frantic attempt to make it look relevant while bolting on a load of expensive new requirements that shot costs through the roof, and incidentally making it too damn expensive to risk in real air-to-ground combat!

If anybody on the Hill had any guts and/or brains they'd make the USAF buy upgraded F-15Es, keep buying improved F-16s, and restart A-10 production from drawings alone. Just keep buying a few planes a year for each type, and keep them continuously in production.

Of course, that wouldn't line the pockets of Lockmart, Boing, and the other crooks nearly as efficiently now, would it? God forbid that we build & maintain a sustainable, AFFORDABLE air combat capability instead of pissing away billions on shiny toys & jingling keys.



that1guy | posted on Jul 22, 2009 @ 03:56


Let's face it: A/A has been dead a LONG time (since Vietnam), and the Fighter Mafia's day is done. Period. And that's all the F-22 ever was: a security blanket for fighter jocks who thought that they were too good for CAS.

I knew the -22 was doomed as soon as it became the "F/A-22"; nothing more than a frantic attempt to make it look relevant while bolting on a load of expensive new requirements that shot costs through the roof, and incidentally making it too damn expensive to risk in real air-to-ground combat!

If anybody on the Hill had any guts and/or brains they'd make the USAF buy upgraded F-15Es, keep buying improved F-16s, and restart A-10 production from drawings alone. Just keep buying a few planes a year for each type, and keep them continuously in production.

Of course, that wouldn't line the pockets of Lockmart, Boing, and the other crooks nearly as efficiently now, would it? God forbid that we build & maintain a sustainable, AFFORDABLE air combat capability instead of pissing away billions on shiny toys & jingling keys.



that1guy | posted on Jul 22, 2009 @ 03:56


Seems to me U.S. conservatives do not believe in global world economy, instead they dream of winning WWIII with Raptors to get rid of United States hopelessly gigantic debt to China. But that means a war nobody can win. Nukes will be used by the part who think first they are losing. The U.S. debt to China and other lenders is mostly caused by Holy American Lifestyle of old, including enormous spending of defence material to pockets of irresponsible military industry. On civilian side of economy, we all should by now know what kind of greed has caused current worldwide financial crisis. Only realistic way for this is work, work and slowly pay the debts. It will suit China fine. Investment to more military spending to solve this situation by war is insanity.

Kari Manninen | posted on Aug 17, 2009 @ 01:00


Seems to me U.S. conservatives do not believe in global world economy, instead they dream of winning WWIII with Raptors to get rid of United States hopelessly gigantic debt to China. But that means a war nobody can win. Nukes will be used by the part who think first they are losing. The U.S. debt to China and other lenders is mostly caused by Holy American Lifestyle of old, including enormous spending of defence material to pockets of irresponsible military industry. On civilian side of economy, we all should by now know what kind of greed has caused current worldwide financial crisis. Only realistic way for this is work, work and slowly pay the debts. It will suit China fine. Investment to more military spending to solve this situation by war is insanity.

Kari Manninen | posted on Aug 17, 2009 @ 01:00


An vover priced piece of crap from the start. No one weapon system wins any war, rather it is the colective will to fight and win. Before the USAF can even get to the fight, the Navy is already there wining air superiority and conducting deep strike missions. While the men in blue tank thier way and get thier "crew rest".

Intruder | posted on Aug 26, 2009 @ 21:37


The canceling of the F-22s is one of the biggest mistakes President Obama did in his presidency.
He thinks the F-35 is enough to defend our country. The F-35 is important for the Air Force because we need modern aircrafts but the price is too high. He wants to set the F-15s, F-16s, F-18s and A-10s out of service because of the aircrafts. Now he will stop the production of the F-22s.
But the F-35 is not enough. We need the F-22s to survive against our enemies...

very-fab | posted on Sep 02, 2009 @ 21:20


I hate how the DOD, and most television programs try to say that the F-35 is more than sufficient enough to replace the F-22. Bullshit, if you ask me.

T3hpr3t3nd3r | posted on Sep 12, 2009 @ 16:43


We NEED more F-22s. Call your senator, toss rocks through their widow. I don't care how but lets get these scumbags to get at least ONE thing right. The F-35 is not a proper F-15 replacement and is not nearly as capable as the F-22! And damn McNamara, I mean Gates and his "one airframe for everything" nonsense.

More F-22s NOW!



PissedOff | posted on Sep 20, 2009 @ 08:09


whoa, if you're gonna drag slurs into this, carlos, not like u spics would understand the value of a fifth generation fighter, since none of you came close to making a modern air-supremacy fighter

raid | posted on Sep 21, 2009 @ 21:39


this is a load of shit. The contractors of the F-22 Raptor signed contract with the white house stating that the F-22 production would not be touched until production was complete. The president so how found a loophole or paid the contractors off for this to happen. this isn't right.

Dan Fryfogle | posted on Oct 02, 2009 @ 02:55


Shame, how everyone on this thread thinks if they pour their liberal hearts out on the internet a radical change will happen in their favor. But the only way we can find a solution everyone wants is to have everyone work together to do what's best for the country. Communism anybody?

Nah just kidding.

But anyways I think we should of kept production of the F-22, to have a effective air superiority fighter, than have some F-35's to compliment the F-22's for CAS and ground attack missions, and update our current fleet of A-10, F-15, F-16's for general purpose missions, because although F-22's would make extremely capable aces, they are simply too expensive to replace the whole air fleet today. F-22's are amazing fighter planes, it's just that they should be used for high priority missions, etc.

Update the current fleet, making them capable against 4th gen fighters, have F-22's and F-35's as superior aces when needed, and our Air Force fleet would dominate. But hey, that's just my opinion. There's probably some flaws to my plan. But whatever.

NOTE: This is only an opinion, not a direct attack to the Obama Administration, any international governments, or anyone on this thread.



John Borrowitz | posted on Oct 13, 2009 @ 01:02


Via email to: Rep. Hall, Sen. Gillibrand, Sen. Schumer, Pres. Obama
Washington DC

March 5, 2009

Dear Mr. and Mrs. Yertle:

I apologize for disturbing you as your economic philosophy continues to make wealthy people poor, and poor people destitute; but if those of your ilk stay true to form you will attempt to balance your social agenda on the back of the national security efforts of the United States. Further, if past is prologue, you’ll make a list of the highest cost programs and begin to chip away at them regardless of how they fit into the overall tapestry of this effort. Before you do this please ask President Obama to secure from our enemies, current and future, an agreement that they will not attack us or our allies. Maybe Mr. Obama can get the same agreement that Prime Minister Chamberlain had Hitler sign?
I bring up the most infamous goose stepping Nazi because, one of, if not the sole reason we and our allies crushed his brand of evil was a result of the meteoric advances in aviation in that time. Admittedly this worked both ways, the French built the useless Maginot Line - only to have it defeated by a Nazi flying an air cooled piston engine with a set of wings that could generate enough lift to overcome its combined weight. As the decades past the United States military has required airplanes that fly farther, faster, and higher. These characteristics enable the military to meet it’s objective of securing this country by sending a clear message to other nations around the world; if you choose to fight in the air, you will lose, so don’t waste time and resources trying. Unfortunately, they did not get the message. They began to innovate methods to detect and destroy our aircraft, surface to air missiles, shoulder fired missiles, and attempt to eclipse our aviation efforts. It soon became clear that to maintain air supremacy we would need an airplane that could evade these threats and still engage the enemy successfully.
At long last we have it in the form of various aircraft that can accomplish this goal to varying degrees depending on their mission objectives. Mr. Obamas budget erodes this capability, and reinforces our current, and future adversaries notion that they can take us in the air. Please stand against it. Military aviation is the lynchpin of our national defense do not allow it to be routed in search of economic social justice (someday someone will have to explain that to me, to give to one you must take from another, just because they have more does not make it justifiable to take it, and in taking it from someone else, you diminish the very desire to make more of it). In fact stand against any effort that would erode our capacity to defend ourselves. In addition I cannot conceive of any greater stimulus for the economy then defense spending. Assembly lines already exist, workers stand ready to create product, lines of raw material supply are well established, and the propensity to spend the profit domestically on research and development is one of the highest of any industry.
In closing, if I were in your position analyzing and debating the cost and benefits of the various parts of the defense budget I would only consider if that weapon system protected my child, while giving him or her the ability to accomplish their mission, would I support it? If the answer is no than I would push for increasing those capabilities that would accomplish that goal. I would never take dollars from that budget to support domestic programs that, but for our strong defense, would not exist in the first place. Frankly, If we are all dead the only program we will need is the body bag program that FEMA runs. Remember that defending this country is an ongoing never ending effort that exists on, and under the sea, on land, and in the air; but if we seed supremacy in the air, or one day in space, no weapon system will ever accomplish its goal of defeating the enemy before they even chamber the first round. We are blessed that we have so many people willing to volunteer to protect us the least we can do is make damned certain we present them with a better mouse trap than the enemy has. If we one day become the paper tiger we were prior to World War Two we will incite the wider wars we work so hard to avoid; if that day comes even you will be singing “Praise the lord and p. the ammunition.”

Respectfully,


Greg Scott | posted on Oct 15, 2009 @ 20:57


the f-22 is the best airplane i ever seen. we need air supremacy over the US 24/7. if we don't. we WILL have more suicidal plane hiting the county. We need good fighters to keep the bads guys out Right. so don't stop the f-22 now. it will be very bad if we stop making F-22. What would you think if think if 9/11 happened again!! then what? we start all over again trying to protect the county. My GOD! what is this county doing. oh wait i know!! GOING DOWN THE CRAPPER!!!

Skykid101 | posted on Oct 21, 2009 @ 21:03


Dear that1guy:

Did you cut off your dick and eat it. It looks that way. the f-22 is the one that is going to are .es in a war.

SKYMAN | posted on Oct 21, 2009 @ 21:20


Didyou cut off your dick and eat it.

ASSkicker | posted on Oct 21, 2009 @ 21:23


Gates is making the nations biggest mistake. We need those jets. We need lots more of those jets plus makin those jets keeps a lot of jobs. Gates is a dumb.

Ty Davus | posted on Nov 07, 2009 @ 21:35


This is stupid. The F-35 is a lawn dart. We can use it to replace the F-16s, F-18s, and hell even the Harriers, but not the F-15s and F-22s. They think that in numbers the F-35 can make up for the F-22. IN NUMBERS. The moto of this contry is Quality over Quantity. What happened to that moto when obama was elected I dont know. It takes four F-35s to equal the engagement power of one F-22. Think about it. More planes equals more pilots. More pilots equals more time and money spent in training. Cheaper plains means less stealth and protection. Less stealth and protection means more chance of getting shot down. More brave pilots dead or stuck behind enemy lines. This is idiotic. Damn Gates. Damn Obama. I'll see them both in hell.

Brandon | posted on Nov 27, 2009 @ 10:49


Obama has just earnd my respect for his speach at west point. I will still see Gates in hell, but Obamas ok

Brandon | posted on Dec 02, 2009 @ 02:43


Just to add fuel to the fire that is already burning here.

If the U.S government cut the production of the F-22 Raptor, there is obviously a great possibility that we will be over run by China or Russia in the coming several decades.

No we are probably not going to get nuked by Russia (although the threat is real.) Nuclear war is the most illogical decision that could ever possible be made by any country. If nuclear warheads are EVER used for military purposes again, it will very quickly (and irreversibly) become Armageddon! With the U.S. and Russia dropping thousands of nukes on the world, the bombs themselves would kill billions, and the rest would definitely die from the fallout and other unforeseen re percussions. And yet, as if to even further weaken the United States, Obama is disrupting the nuclear triad of Army, Air force, and Navy by removing the Army! With the Army consisting of most of the countries nuclear ordinance, we are left with some 2,000 warheads to defend ourselves from Russia's immense 19,000! With 90% of that 2,000 being destroyed by defense systems, that leaves us with only a few hundred left to strike thousands if not millions of square miles! Preposterous!!!

Now to the Raptor, It is an incredible fighter! It obviously outperforms all other U.S. made fighters (if not every fighter ever created!) It won the X prize not some 20 years ago or less and it's been in production for less than 5 years!!! All other U.S. made fighters (even ones that weren't the best in the world) were m. produced for decades!!!! This is THE best option for America right now and the government is even considering scraping the project!?!?! No other fighter has thrust vectoring and the F-22 incredible stealth capabilities! All the JSF-35 has is VTOL!!!! The F-22 flies circles around that piece of crap! 186 is an impossibley low number of fighters! I don't believe that any other fighter that has ever gone into production has lasted this short of a time and was produced in this small of numbers! The F-22 has great potential and would easily fill the void left by the Eagle!

I hope dearly the Congress saves this masterpiece from a very untimely death!

John | posted on Dec 09, 2009 @ 02:39


Hey people in peace we do not need fighters :-)

Jan | posted on Dec 19, 2009 @ 23:38


suck a cock Jan we plan for the futer

Brandon | posted on Dec 23, 2009 @ 07:35


suck a cock Jan we plan for the futer

Brandon | posted on Dec 23, 2009 @ 07:35


The USA is again flexing it's stupidity. Develope a fighter that will out cl. anything there is anywhere on the planet, put it in to production, start getting rid of the second best fighter the world has ever seen (the F-15), and then stop production. Does anyone in Washington have a brain in their head? (Washington DC that is). Using the rational that the F-35 JSF can handle the low-tech battlefields that the USA now faces is the most unintelligent statement that I have heard on this subject. Remember the Braodway Play "Annie" and the song "Tomorrow." I guess that technology has stopped advancing if we believe the arguments against the F-22. We should all just wait until we get our collective .es shot off, say "oops" and then start building weapons that will keep us ahead of the rest of the world.

G | posted on Mar 25, 2010 @ 17:08


yea I no the f-22 Raptor is da best fighter eva..... and it can drop nukes!!!!!!!!!!!!!! like in MW2!!!! PS3

nathan | posted on May 14, 2010 @ 18:32


Obama sucks ....................' he's black

nathan | posted on May 14, 2010 @ 18:34


hey obama may i call u my futher , how the . can u do this, u are intentionally trying to destroy the country and ruin millions of jobs that created this buetiful plane. and then what did u do ........ u start to get rid of our nukes and then dont do shit about the oil in the gulf. F-U OBAMA

josh | posted on Jun 30, 2010 @ 02:57


And remember Gates, is a REPUBLICAN, who served under President George H. Bush (appointed by a Republican to be Director of Central Intelligence), so if he is a moron wouldn't that make you a moron, for voting as a REPUBLICAN.

DC | posted on Oct 28, 2010 @ 23:51


Manned air superiority aircraft are rapidly becoming a thing of the past. The pilot is the weakest link in a high performance combat aircraft. Pilot error has lost us well over 90% of all aircraft in mishaps since WWII. While safety programs have really improve the statistics, we are rapidly approaching the capability to develop 6th generation air superiority and strike aircraft, all the capabilities of the F-22/-35 and beyond, in an unmanned platform. In the meantime, nearly 200 F-22s will keep us way in front.

Flightdoc | posted on Jan 11, 2011 @ 05:14


F-22 has one mission, air superiority. Why does it need the the capability to drop bombs? We have many other capable platforms to drop bombs including unmanned and missile systems. Try to make it it into a "jack of all trades" is a mistake the US has made before. The F-22 should penetrate enemy air space, and eliminate fighter opposition. One mission.

Jason | posted on Dec 09, 2011 @ 21:57


Someone I profession with visits your blog rather commonly and recommended it to me to read too. The letters style is great and the happiness is interesting. Thanks in the interest of the percipience you give the readers!
Frank Gore Elite Jersey

Frank Gore Elite Jersey | posted on Sep 30, 2012 @ 23:59


You americans are a m. danger to yourselves and the rest of the free world.this isnt the cold war anymore and your country is in a mountain of debt.100s of millions of dollars on this aicraft is pointless.there are enough raptors to take out everything russia or china could sent up you dont need more.but if you do buy more to defend yourselves then your people could end up broke and starving.well worth it for a cold war relic! russia and china have no interest in invading or attacking you they make billions from you as trade partners.the world have changed since the berlin wall came down now its time to changr your paranoia and down right ignorance of the rest of the world

lceman | posted on Jun 28, 2013 @ 03:03


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  USAF F-22A pilot recruitment trailer
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